CHARLESTON, W.Va. — The company at the center of the West Virginia water emergency filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy Friday in U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Charleston.

Freedom Industries said it can’t pay its bills because those it does business with are demanding cash payments because of the leak.

(Read Freedom’s bankruptcy filing here)

In the filing, Freedom said it’s been hypothesized that a water line break near its facility on Barlow Drive caused the ground below its chemical tank to freeze causing the leak from the tank.

Freedom has said it believes 7,500 gallons of crude MCHM leaked.

U.S. Attorney Booth Goodwin said Friday the bankruptcy filing would have no impact on his ongoing federal criminal investigation.

 

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Comments

  • LEE ARTHUR

    I feel sorry for you people in WV , you're so hard up for work that your government brings in all these chemical companies that no one else wants and lets them abuse the system.

    • Aaron

      I'm curious Me. Arthur, how do you conclude a storage tank farm is a chemical company and why do you think they are exclusive to WV.

      I'm also curious how you get WV is any more hard up for work than other states when our unemployment rate is below the national average.

      Can you elaborate?

      • wvtd

        do not expect a coherent answer from a liberal. they will just end up calling you a racist or something. I feel sorry Arthur, to much Kool-Aid.

      • Frank

        Aaron you're correct, WV has a low unemployment rate. But, to use a GOP argument, unemployment doesn't take into consideration all the people who have "given up" looking for work. Or more over, the example of many in the Coal Counties who have never worked & have always relied on my tax dollars from states you (& WVTD) would call "liberal".
        25% of WV's economy (before the chemical spill) is based on US Government giving WV residents money (Unemployment, disability, various forms of social security). WV is the #1 state in receiving more money than it contributes to the government coffers. Earning it the right of being the #1 in the US as a "Taker State". So Arthur's comments about WV needing more "risky" industries is correct. But, then again, WV's economy has always been based on "risky" industries like coal & drugs like heroin!

        • Aaron

          I don't dispute that there is a large portion of citizens on welfare Frank but to say that a quarter of our economy is based on what we get from the feds seems high to me. Where do you get that number.

          As for WV being a taker state, that number refers to federal tax dollars received for every tax dollar received. The latest numbers I can find are from 2007 and that placed WV 5th at 1.76 for every tax dollar paid. That was before Bob Byrd's death, Obama's failed stimulus and our punishment from the Obama administration for handing him some of his most humiliating defeats.

          With the reduction in infrastructure spending and our added burden due to the stimulus in which the average WV taxpayer pays back 1.55 for every dollar received, I'd say our ranking has dropped somewhat.

          As to his comments about the tank farms, every state has them thus his comments were anecdotal at best, as it seems, are yours.

    • BigMo

      Most of the chemical companies are gone or in the process of leaving the Kanawha Valley. The Institute Site is mostly gravel and so is South Charleston.

    • Robin

      Arthur it shows just how much you know about the history of this state and the area specifically. Charleston, Nitro area use to be the chemical capitol of the world. There is next to nothing there now. The water is clean and is used for recreation.

  • Aaron

    First off, anyone who surprises this action for well is either naive or, well let's just leave it at that.

    Of course they filed bankruptcy. They had no other choice. They have millions upon millions of dollars in liabilities, Any income they have is going to be confiscated, so they have no way of paying their bills. As such no vendor in their right mind would do business with them.

    I'm certainly not defending Freedom because I believe whoever was responsible for ensuring the retaining walls were in proper working should be looking at criminal charges.

    But I don't see is how making inaccurate statements regarding bankruptcy laws or implying this is something that could happen only in West Virginia adds anything to the conversation.

  • james

    DZirkle

    Why doesn't WV take the lead in irradicating bankruptcy abuse?????????????????

    Take a class in civics and government. Bankruptcy is a federal action and the state is preempted. Why don't some of you actually do some reading and research before spouting off. This is why WV is usually the but(t) of other states jokes.

    Here is a cite to an online dictionary if you want to look preempted up:

    http://dictionary.reference.com/

    • Larry

      Are you serious, WV is not going to take the "lead" in anything with the Democrat party in control, except the number of deadbeat welfare recipients and we already lead that category.

      • cutty77

        No. Lawyers Run WV. Thats why we are almost last in Everything. Who do you think in charge at The Statehouse. LAWYERS.

        • Larry

          Even worse, "Democrat party lawyers"!

          • Frank

            You're right Larry, the "Democrats" are to blame for the lack of work ethic, the desire to drop out of school (or is it skool) , and rampant drugs in WV. Take away those damn Democrats, and you'd be Ohio???
            Ha ha ha ha ha... Larry YOU ARE the punch line in a joke that is West Virginia!

          • Wowbagger

            Since the Democratic Party has been dominant in West Virginia since 1932 (yes that's 82 years) excepting a couple of Republican Governors I contend you can make the argument that they own the current economy, have a lot of responsibility for the state of the education system, and the legal system.

    • WVU 74

      For decades the unwritten rule, for corporations, in the WV legal system has been: You can profit from your own wrong.

  • jay ziehm

    most people pay bills with cash/debit card or check if a check bounces you suffer the consequences debit card refused. don't understand the problem sounds like a way out for future litigation and stall any possible lawsuits for years and years

  • Frank / Moundsville

    David, explain exactly how anyone but the lawyers benefit from a bankruptcy filing.

  • David

    As reported elsewhere, the financial backing for the bankruptcy itself is coming from the very same guy who is owner of Freedom Industries. If the restructuring fails, the person who finances the bankruptcy stands to gain tremendously.
    So understand this, the owner of the company filing bankruptcy finances the bankruptcy. If the bankruptcy fails, the owner wins.
    This needs to be stopped. The owner of a company shouldn't be able to benefit when his own company's apparent negligence was the root cause of this whole debacle.

    • Taxpayer

      Dude, you are completely ignorant about how bankruptcy works. You don't "finance" a bankruptcy and a bankruptcy doesn't "fail".

  • Frank / Moundsville

    Boy, this was a hard one to predict............WV American Water can't be too far behind in the bankruptcy line.

  • wvtd

    damn that was quick.

  • Fed Up

    What happened to the million bucks in stimulus money they got to rebuild the retaining pit..

    • wirerowe

      Stimulus money was for dredging the Elk. Well you can't call it dredging. According to some reports Freedom had recently escrowed $1million to upgrade the secondary containment
      area but had not got around to it.

  • J the C

    These people are criminals. Morissey better be on top of this. "Friends of coal" and "Coal is West Virginia!" What a joke.

  • Mike

    The President of that company should lose everything he has, business and personal assets. He's nothing but scum. State officials should not let him and his company get away with this.

    • WV Redneck

      The president only owned this place for 9 days when this happened but you will probably get your wish. He also bought the disaster unfortunately for him and is still ultimately responsible

  • DZirkle

    Here we go again. Some out of state conglomerate buys out a company in WV and then uses the opportunity to gain as much finanncially as possible without investing any capital in the infrastructure that would prohibit my friends from suffering unbelievable hardships.
    Wv and its legislature needs to put a stop to this very comfortable legal move to declaring bankruptcy and so to avoid the financial responsibility due those that were the victims of their greed and avarice. Profit above all else.

    How long are we going to tolerate the corruption that has allowed these groups to come to this state and steal as much as they can and then declare bankruptcy to avoid their absolute obligations to make things right???? Enough is enough!!!!!!

    Fracking and the infinite destruction of our most valuable resource, WATER!!!!, is another example of our happy news that we will now have more jobs available. What about salt, oil, coal, and timber opportunities????? All those seem to have worked out well for all of us!!!!!

    • WV Redneck

      You are a piece of work. I didn't like what happened either. I was one of the last to get water back and I don't trust it. However, this guy didn't get rich at our expense. He got bankrupt. He only owned the place for 9 days when this happened. Like it or not, while financially responsible, it wasn't his fault.

      Further, go get some real education on fracking rather than repeating discredited miss-information. You are SOOOO misinformed!

      • DZirkle

        It is about the water. Think about it for just a minute.........life without any water.....

        • WV Redneck

          Think about it. The average water well is maybe 100 feet. The average gas well is 5 to 7 thousand feet and isolated from the bedrock up via layers of steel casings and concrete. A fracked zone is only a couple hundred feet of micro fractures at best. Fracking cannot cause what your worried about in and of itself. Only a bad cement job could and that would only allow gas to escape up the back of the well not liquids cause their thousands of feet down due to gravity.

          Learn the truth

          • WV Redneck

            Also, if the DEP were doing the job they should be and inspecting all these chemical storage facilities rather than just select ones this may have been avoided.

          • Jason412

            WV Redneck I've been doing a lot of reading on fracking lately and was wanting to ask you how you feel about Exxon facing felony charges in PA for improper dumping? 5 million gallons I believe it was, I'll double check in the morning.

            And the cement on them wells cracking is what ends up leaking, I'm pretty sure most realize it's not the process as much as bad concrete and terrible procedures as far as dumping.

            The Dimock PA case was all about cracked wells. I love how you say "only allow gas to escape" yeah, because I know I'd sleep easy at night knowing only gas was leaking. Look at what the EPA was saying pre-Obama then post-Obama, obviously swept under the rug.

            The guys I know who work for gas companies in PA and OH tell it completely different then you which is what has got me so interested in this lately, but I'd like to hear your side.

          • MT

            Truth is fracking is a danger thats being ignored. Hopefully this accident in will awaken the public to dangers WV is facing with its water. Bad enough that you can't eat any fish out of our beautiful rivers now we can't even drink it.

            SAD!!!!

          • Jason412

            Just checked and it was 57,000 gallons not 5 million, my mistake. They removed a plug on a waste water tank intentionally, then said they didn't think "it would have any lasting environmental impact"

          • Aaron

            I'd be interested in how the guys you know in PA and OH are telling it different than is being told here.

            Also, you talked about the "cement" cracking leading to leaks and then you said the bad "concrete" was at fault.

            Which is at fault, bad cement or bad concrete?

          • WV Redneck

            Jason,
            It wasn't about cement cracks. It was blamed on the fracking itself and the fact is those that had methane in their water had it long before any wells were drilled. Heck, one had even posted a video on YouTube of it something like 2 years prior and then were trying to sue blaming the gas company. Ever heard of Burning Springs Jason?

            I haven't heard about the Exxon spill but if it was intentional they need to be severely punished.

            It's pretty strange how you know all these gas people in other states that just hate the evil company's they work for and scurry to tell only you all the dirt they can manufacture so you can avenge them by posting it here.

            Give it a rest bud, your beat and you know it. In the end, the truth always wins.

          • Jason412

            Aaron, if you notice that was posted at almost 2 am God forbid I misspoke. Nice try though, I found your post very informative and I really like how you provided absolutely no information. How about actually making a point next time.

            What do my friends tell me? Exactly what I just said in the last post, that it's not a problem with the drilling it's that the cement gets half-assed, cracks, and leads to all the problems. So I started reading into that, turns out, other people (well known Scientists, mainly) say the same thing.


            WVRedneck - The guys I know who work for the companies do it because they have no other option. Where I live if you only graduated high school and want to make a halfway livable wage it's either the mines or gas, and the mine's aren't really hiring. And they damn sure ain't telling it only to me, they'll tell it to anybody who asks. Also, these guys aren't from the states of OH and PA they're from the town I live in and they get sent there.

            I'm not surprised you don't know about the Exxon situation, as you seem to know nothing about it besides what you've clearly been told by your company. It's been all over the news for months, and again recently as they were formally charged.

            You say they need to be severely punished like they're the only company that's done it. They just did it in the wrong place, and are the only ones that will be charged. Exxon themselves said it's standard practice in the entire industry and criminally charging them would discourage gas in the area in the future.

            "It's not that drilling for oil and gas is bad. It's not that drilling has to result in environmental destruction. It's just that sometimes it turns out that way because a few key people are greedy or just plain lazy, from the management down to the field workers. But I say it's all up to the cement job." - James Conca, Forbes
            http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesconca/2012/09/10/the-fracking-solution-is-a-good-cement-job/

            Just curious, WV Redneck, when you guys frack a well, and leave, how many times have you personally went back and inspected the cement on each well? How often do you do it? Every week? Every few months? Never? I'm betting on never.

            You tell me give it up, but your the one that jumps to defend fracking at every chance, and sound like a broken record doing it. Why is it I only see you post when someone mentions fracking?

            You keep defending the actual drilling of the well, that's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about the FINISHING of the well(the cement) and what happens when the well is finished (improper disposal). I know a lot of it is recycled, but 57,000 gallons intentionally dumped by one of the biggest companies in the world, and then defended by said company, is very telling of common procedure. Not to mention all the "accidental spills"

            If fracking is done right, I'm fine with it. The wells look ugly as hell and I'd be pissed if there were 10 wells right up to my property line, but it doesn't poison water.

            But the problem is if you drill 50 wells and 49 are perfect but 1 isn't and the cement is screwed up and the waste water is dumped into a stream, it's enough to do a lot of damage.

            I'll give it a rest when you admit your industry is far from perfect and has screwed a lot of people by half-assing things. Since I'm sure you won't be admitting that, I'll keep asking my friends what they think and then reading corresponding facts from reputable sources

          • Jason412

            WV Redneck

            Since you could use the information,
            http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/press.aspx?id=7191

            This is my favorite part
            "The grand jury found that XTO hired a company to recycle waste water at the Marquardt site from Nov. 4, 2010 through Nov. 11, 2010. After that one-week period, XTO directed that company to remove their processing equipment from the site and transport it to another XTO well site in West Virginia. However, XTO allegedly continued to transport and store gas well waste water at the Marquardt site despite not having the proper equipment on site to safely store or process it."

            XTO is part of Exxon. This wouldn't have been discovered if not for a surprise PA DEP inspection, how many sites are doing this and just haven't been inspected by the DEP?

          • WV Redneck

            Jason you are so exhausting. All you know is what you read and for the most part all you will read is anything you can find that is bad, real or not.

            Firstly, cement jobs are not part of the "finishing" of a well. It's part of its construction. It is rare for a cement job to be bad as it's filled from the bottom up but it does happen and can be fixed and usually is.

            I work in the field Jason not in drilling. I see the aftermath and have been around a lot of drilling and I can tell you it's not one out of 50. More like one in thousands but your the expert.

            Keep on looking bud, your being educated. Your stories keep evolving and your beginning to sound more desperate trying to dig up stuff to counter me with.

            Why do I jump in on the fracking comments? Cause I'm tired of people like you who think they know what their talking about, repost other peoples garbage on the internet that is simply untrue and only a product of them trying to sue and make money on a booming industry because they otherwise don't have a way to profit off it themselves.

          • Jason412

            So Forbes and the Attorney General of Pennsylvania are not credible sources? Are you suggesting the Attorney General website I linked is fake, or are you just unable to accept facts? I notice still very little mention of Exxon dumping the 50 thousand gallons. No comment on that other then "they should be punished" and your usual lines of "that's just one bad company" seems to remember last time you were blaming it on the company it wasn't Exxon.

            Finding something to counter you with takes very little effort, since I never have to counter anything but your word as a gas company employee which I suppose I, as the non-gas industry employee, am supposed to just take as gospel.

            Reposting other peoples garbage? Sorry I'm not in law enforcement, so I will admit I had to reference the Attorney General on a criminal case. Not that an Attorney General's word is credible when compared to a gas industry employee though.

            Are you suggesting Exxon wasn't charged? Or that they didn't dump the wastewater? Sorry you lost me after you said the Attorney General's website wasn't credible

            I apologize that I read, I know most people the gas industry tries to push their facts on don't and it's a shame.

            And as much as you'd like people to believe that my friend's that work in the gas industry aren't bad mouthing the impacts of it every time I ask them about it then I guess you just can't accept someones word as truth, unless it's your word then we're supposed to just accept that it couldn't be false. Obviously no one's word matters but yours, as a gas company employee.

            When you're hearing claims from reliable sources, then finding corresponding information that supports said claims, what do you call that in the gas industry?

            I wonder if people from Freedom Industries defended their chemical facility as hard as you defend the gas industry.

            Just for good measure here is the article from the Wall Street Journal that was the source of information for the Forbes article. I notice the WSJ are the ones who told us West Virginian's when the DEP had inspected, even though the DEP didn't know. Are they also not credible, compared to you, the gas company employee?
            "Faulty wells, Not Fracking, Blamed for Water Pollution"
            http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304537904577277814040731688?mg=reno64-wsj&url=http%3A%2F%2Fonline.wsj.com%2Farticle%2FSB10001424052702304537904577277814040731688.html

            And the reason I keep saying things like "you, the gas company employee" is just to reiterate how little your word means compared to scientists, Forbes, and the WSJ.

            I guess everyone in the world against the way the gas industry is currently ran are "just trying to sue and make money off a booming industry" even journalists for some of the most respected publications in the world.

          • Jason412

            Just want to add, Russell Gold, who wrote the WSJ article, was a Pullitzer Prize finalist. But I'm sure your credibility can trump that.

          • Jason412

            Oh and like every other question, you deflected me asking how frequently you return to these wells.

            You've seen the aftermath, ok. How frequently? Do you personally go check each well once a week? Once a month? Or only right after the job is done?

            And just as a reminder, besides what my friends tell me, I did live in the middle of S.W. PA for a good portion of my life during the fracking boom, as well as Steubenville Ohio for about a year right around the time Youngstown had all the earthquakes. So I haven't always just been reading from the side lines.

          • WV Redneck

            Ok Jason, here it goes. First, I don't believe for a second that you have any friends let alone all these friends in the Gas industry. So let's just push that aside.

            Second, I did not deflect your question about how often I go to these wells. I told I work in the field. If you actually had your so called friends you refer to you would know that is industry speak for someone who works with the wells and pipelines. In other words Jason, I go to them daily. Every day Jason ok.

            Next, an attorney general. A politically aquired position. One voted for by pressing the right buttons of the voters. No, I don't find that as a reliable source of information as all politicians do is pander to the public so they can get re elected. So thus, I didn't waste my time reading your reference.

            The Wall Street Journal. A left leaning political hack machine writing an article about environmental issues in the gas industry. Considering Obama's stance on carbon based fuels and he is the lefts glorious leader I don't read nor have any desire to read any of their politically motivated dribble.

            The Exxon dump. Back in 2010. Ok, got me to read about it. Going by your quote it was the same article you read. Again, they should be severely punished. What more do you want me to say pal? That someone was an idiot and pulled a plug?

            Where you live? He'll bud, where anyone lives. The gas company's pay very well and anyone who gets a job with one is damn lucky. Probably is the root of your issue, you didn't and I can understand why in just these exchanges with you.

          • Jason412

            First off, I don't care what you think about me because you seem to be nothing other then a gas industry shill. You remind me of that Irish guy who acts like Michael Moore from Fracknation. That whole movie plays like one big commercial and so do your posts.

            You go to the wells everyday? So after a well is finished and everyone leaves the site you go back and check every well every single day? Hundreds and hundreds of wells and you go back every single day and check them? I just want to make that clear, every well, every day?

            And nah I ain't mad that I don't work in the gas industry. I did this thing called "go to college" you know, so that I can make a decent living without being a slave to a company. When I did it my intentions were not to be a slave to a coal company like most of my family, but a gas company plays the same role.

          • Jason412

            HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA I just seen your post saying "Watch Fracknation for some real information" ARE YOU SERIOUS? I have never seen such a phony movie in my entire life. "Paid for by people from all over the world!" Reminds me of Breaking Bad when Walter White had his lawyer making "donations" to his kid's charity from "all over the world" when really it was 1 person sitting in a room, changing their IP address. You can download programs to change your IP to any country in the world for about 2$ a month. If I can do it, I'm sure a gas company can.

            You know, I kind of respected your opinion before this most recent debate. But after you tell me to watch "Fracknation and learn the truth" that would be like me telling you "Watch Gasland and learn the truth" They are both as equally ridiculous.

            So the AG isn't credible, the WSJ isn't credible, but some Irish guy who clearly is getting paid by the gas companies is credible?

            I encourage anyone to watch that movie to see how scripted it is. Listen to the way the people talk, it's about as obviously fake as any documentary I've ever seen in my life.

            Now I know why you are the way you are and it explains why you brought up Burning Springs. If you're dumb enough to believe that movie was some kind of independent journalism then it explains everything about you.

            I watch every movie that comes out about it and Fracknation is by far the worst of the worst, I watched it with an open mind but it only takes about 5 minutes to see this guy is telling you what the gas companies want him to. Even my girl thought that movie was absurd and she couldn't care less about the subject.

            Watched Promised Land yesterday, it was terrible but at least they tell you it's a Hollywood movie and not try to make out like it's some documentary paid for by the people.

            Thanks for making my day "watch fracknation and learn the truth" haha I'll be laughing about that all day.

          • Jason412

            From NYDailyNews
            "With many of McAleer’s facts coming from casual Internet searches (backed by boring shots of the computer screen), the accuracy of this crowd-sourced documentary — funded by small donations on Kickstarter — seems as reliable as a Wikipedia entry."

            If you've seen the movie, you'd know this is true, half the movie is shots of his computer. Most of his "facts" are looked up on the internet. To you, when he looks up things on the internet and puts it a movie it's "the truth" but when I do it I "only know what I read and only read the bad" and it's all false. What kind of logic is that?

            I know you wont read it, even though you keep accusing me of being closed minded but here is parts of an interview with the Irish Michael Moore from the PPG.

            "The film, however, is being partially funded through donations on the Kickstarter website, and the roster of "executive producers" who have donated at least $1 includes scores of energy industry associates. The filmmakers said Thursday they plan to return any donations given by "senior" workers in the industry, which they define as executives."

            "The roster of "executive producers" helping to finance the film includes the director of an Ohio-based oil and gas outreach program and the head of external affairs at Cabot Oil and Gas, the company that's fought accusations of water contamination in Dimock, Pa., for the past several years."

            http://www.post-gazette.com/businessnews/2012/03/04/Industry-gets-cast-in-FrackNation-the-latest-documentary-on-the-drilling-debate/stories/201203040252

            So not only was it paid for by gas companies, the gas companies who paid into it had a very vested interest in the way they were depicted.

            I did like when he suggested that Putin pays for all the anti-fracking movement, and provides absolutely no proof of such. Pretty much saying if you're not 100% for the gas industry you're backing a Communist. Oh and the 5 minute long cartoon explaining how fracking works, that was definitely a highlight.

            If these half-assed cement jobs are so rare then why in one of your original posts did you say
            " Only a bad cement job could and that would only allow gas to escape up."

          • Aaron

            Not to rain on the debate you have going on Jason but the only point of my post yesterday was to clarify the mistake you made regarding cement and concrete.

            I ask about your friends because in reading the ongoing debate between you and WVredneck, he seems like his comments come from experience whereas yours come from internet searches.

            As you've mentioned your 'friends' numerous times as a means to counter his real world experience, it seems to me that your information is really from primarily anti-fracking web sites and as such, your comments do not seem very credible.

            So, as you read the Wall Street Journal article from 2012, do you think their should be tighter regulations regarding cementing gas wells?

          • WV Redneck

            Aaron, thank you.

            Jason, your post just ended our debate. Your some little punk just out of school, maybe still in school, that thinks he knows everything and in truth son, you don't know anything.

            Aaron is right, internet search's is all you know. Even on your last post every single thing was quotes from the internet that you don't even take the time like a good little student and rephrase into your own words.

            At any rate, this has gone as far as it can go. Maybe one day I will see you out in the field and I can introduce you to some of the other people who you have insulted and are attempting through your spread of anti gas industry crap to put an end to their livelihood and give you a chance to make some real friends in the field. I'm sure some of them would love to meet ya

          • Jason412

            Aaron, please watch Fracknation and tell me he hasn't pulled 90% of his posts off that movie. I had just watched it again today and it's very familiar.. From a guy who mislead me on numbers by literally hundreds of trucks, do you trust his "real world experience"? To answer your question, yes I think if they regulate the cement and waste water more I would be fine with the gas industry.

            Also, how credible would it sound if I always said "well my friend told me" or "yeah a buddy told me" I see them, I ask, they tell me, I look it up, I read, form an opinion about it and maybe write a post over it in which I will include the source of the information that doesn't start with "well someone told me" I mean seriously?

            Do you consider Forbes, the WSJ, and the PA AG anti-fracking sites? If these aren't credible, what is? I have to go work in the gas industry to have an opinion on it? How about the NY Department of Conservation? I've started reading this
            http://www.dec.ny.gov/energy/75370.html and it contradicts almost everything WV redneck says. Particularly what I point out below.

            WV Redneck learned something today . Remember a few months back you told me it was like 25 or 50 trucks per well? I can't remember the exact number but it was under 100.

            I found a chart from the NY Department of Conservation it says if all water is transported by truck the average is 1,148 "total one-way loaded trips per well" If the water doesn't have to be trucked in it drops to 398 total one-way loaded trips.

            The total number of truck trips(accounting for round trips) for a Horizontal Well with High-Volume Hydraulic Fracturing range from 3,950 to 1,634.



            I know you wont read it but in case you want to see the chart
            http://www.dec.ny.gov/docs/materials_minerals_pdf/rdsgeisch6b0911.pdf But I guess the NY Department of Conservation must be in it just to sue the gas companies.

            WvRedneck I'm sorry I don't plagiarize and try to pass it off as my own work. I hear and then read, and base my opinion on the facts. I post the links to give you the same option, you just chose not to read it. I don't want people to take my word for it, they can see it themselves.

            I'm not anti-gas, I'm anti-bad cement and anti-misinformation which you seem to be excellent at spreading.

            The reason I got into your "LEARN THE TRUTH" post is because you don't tell the truth.You say it takes less then 100 truck loads, it's literally hundreds if not thousands. You told me a straight up lie. And remember, I'm not the one who brought fracking into a Freedom Industries article. I know you wont respond since I dont think you're going to disprove the NY DEC but see ya next time.

          • Jason412

            Aaron, please watch Fracknation and tell me he hasn't pulled 90% of his posts off that movie. I had just watched it again today and it's very familiar.. From a guy who mislead me on numbers by literally hundreds of trucks, do you trust his "real world experience"? To answer your question, yes I think if they regulate the cement and waste water more I would be fine with the gas industry.

            Also, how credible would it sound if I always said "well my friend told me" or "yeah a buddy told me" I see them, I ask, they tell me, I look it up, I read, form an opinion about it and maybe write a post over it in which I will include the source of the information that doesn't start with "well someone told me" I mean seriously?

            Do you consider Forbes, the WSJ, and the PA AG anti-fracking sites? If these aren't credible, what is? I have to go work in the gas industry to have an opinion on it? How about the NY Department of Conservation? I've started reading this
            http: //www .dec.ny. gov/energy/75370 .html (take the spaces out metronews moderated me) and it contradicts almost everything WV redneck says. Particularly what I point out below.

            WV Redneck learned something today . Remember a few months back you told me it was like 25 or 50 trucks per well? I can't remember the exact number but it was under 100.

            I found a chart from the NY Department of Conservation it says if all water is transported by truck the average is 1,148 "total one-way loaded trips per well" If the water doesn't have to be trucked in it drops to 398 total one-way loaded trips.

            The total number of truck trips(accounting for round trips) for a Horizontal Well with High-Volume Hydraulic Fracturing range from 3,950 to 1,634.



            I know you wont read it but in case you want to see the chart
            http :/ / www .dec.ny. gov/docs/materials_minerals _pdf/rdsgeisch6b0911. pdf (Take the spaces out) But I guess the NY Department of Conservation must be in it just to sue the gas companies.

            WvRedneck I'm sorry I don't plagiarize and try to pass it off as my own work. I hear and then read, and base my opinion on the facts. I post the links to give you the same option, you just chose not to read it. I don't want people to take my word for it, they can see it themselves.

            I'm not anti-gas, I'm anti-bad cement and anti-misinformation which you seem to be excellent at spreading.

            The reason I got into your "LEARN THE TRUTH" post is because you don't tell the truth.You say it takes less then 100 truck loads, it's literally hundreds if not thousands. You told me a straight up lie. And remember, I'm not the one who brought fracking into a Freedom Industries article.


            Also, don't threaten me with your company cronies. I assure you that ain't scaring nobody and it just makes you look bad.

          • Jason412

            Also, I don't see regulating cement and waste water removal as trying to put an end to anybody's livelihood. Last thing I want is for people to lose jobs. Gas isn't in as bad of a spot financially as the coal industry and a few stronger regulations on cement and waste water would not do anywhere near as much damage to the gas industry as the coal industry.

            You keep making out like I'm some anti-fracking activist and I'm not. I've said 100 times I'm all for it if it's done the right way. I guess there's just no middle of the road for you huh? If I want to make sure 57,000 gallons of waste water isn't intentionally getting dumped in a stream doesn't become a regular occurence I'm anti-gas and trying to take jobs from people.

          • Jason412

            Aaron this is a 15 minute clip of Fracknation, the movie WV Redneck says watch to learn the "truth". If this isn't propaganda I don't know what is, the fact it was paid for by gas company executives further emphasizes how fake it is. Sadly, this 15 minutes is the absolute best part of the movie with the other 50-60 minutes spent mostly bashing Josh Fox. This Fracknation guy literally credits Gasland for fracking being outlawed in Europe, that is an absurd unproven claim.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B03IYdHpvAM

            Is this Fracknation a credible source of information compared to the sites I've linked during this most recent debate? I'll admit, the last time I was less informed and may of linked to some anti-fracking sites that is why I started to ask the people I know and then reading based on what they told me which is how I ended up reading the articles from 2012.

            The more I read the more I'm able to realize what is fraudulent and what is not. Fracknation spreads just as much if not more misinformation as Gasland. How would the debate have looked if I said "watch Gasland to learn the truth" like he did.

            I don't think any of the links I've linked in the last day or so have been anti-fracking at all, since they all say pretty much the same thing as me that fracking is fine when done right.

          • WV Redneck

            I didn't "lie" to you Jason. The example I gave were for wells drilled here in WV which is what we were discussing is correct. Single bore vertical well with no horizontal legs 4 to 7 thousand feet deep. Now if you want to talk about PA with shale layers 4 to 7 hundred foot thick being drilled with multiple bore holes per pad with multiple horizontal legs per hole. That changes the equation substantially.

            That's ok though big man. You go look everywhere you can and copy and paste all you want, quote all you want. You have exposed yourself as a know nothing Google Troll. I couldn't ask for a better outcome.

        • Jason412

          No, we were talking about PA. I was talking about when I lived there and what it was like I knew it was way more then 25-50. You caught me in a wording technicality because I kept saying "to frack a well" but you knew what I meant.

          Also, in that article it was talking about how the companies from PA will be coming to WV. So they will be drilling horizontal. Every damn thing with you people is some industry slang that you word everything very carefully so as you can tell a straight up lie but deny it when you get caught by referring to the wording.

          A know nothing google troll? The same troll who said from experience of LIVING THERE I knew it was way more then 25-50, I just couldn't find the proof to back it up until now and like I said my word means nothing because I admit that I don't work in the gas industry, at least now everyone here can see your word also means nothing because even if you do work in the gas industry you're telling straight lies about it.

          A troll who gets his facts straight from a straight agency who is obviously far more reliable then you, the gas company shill.

          While I may have to resort to google at least I don't spread straight falsehoods. I don't debate for fun, I do it to learn, you do it for...I'm not sure why you do it.

          If you feel like you won, good. Keep lying cause I'll be here to catch it so at least people in WV know what they're going to be dealing with before it gets here, PA wasn't so lucky.

          And you can bet I'm going to spread that chart like wildfire. I wonder how small town WV will feel when they got ONE to THREE THOUSAND trucks going thru their town of 2,000 in a few day-week period.

          Remember in one of your first post you said "give it up your beat" damn I'm glad I don't half-ass things like gas companies do that cement, because for a second people were trusting your word. Wonder if they will now?

          LEARN THE TRUTH

          haha isn't that what y'all say?

          • Jason412

            And here's the posts... Funny how I had mentioned my friend affirming the information of hundreds then, but that must of been a lie to. You kept being very careful to say to frack a well, when you knew I meant the entire process.

            Jason412: (Edited out rest of post talking to Shadow) As far as private property, the roads used for the hundreds of trucks each gas well requires are certainly not private property.

            WVRedneck: You obviously don't know anything about Fracking! There isn't "hundreds" of trucks. More like 20 tops and they come in there one time for a day or two to frack the well. The drill rig while quite heavy makes two. One in and one out. You have a couple trucks, low boys that bring in an escavator or two and a dozer but they also only make two trips. In and out. A few trucks loaded with pipe also. Aside from that it's pick ups just like the ones everyone drives around here. (Edited out his following rant on coal)


            Haha. 20 tops! Twenty! Man, talk about a discrepancy from over 1,000. Keep in mind that chart lists HEAVY TRUCKS as over 1,000 one way trips and light trucks as a few hundred. They are not added together.

            Like I said, you caught me in a wording technicality. You did say one thing that was right yesterday, I am learning and the more I learn the more I see how carefully worded everything you say is with industry words makes me wonder if you're not on some PR team.

            Aaron, if you want to trust this guys "real world experience" after that then have at it. I'll stick to asking friends, and then checking on the information superhighway because at this point, it's proven to be a far more reliable source of information.

          • Jason412

            Forgot to link that post where I copied/pasted that convo from, don't want anybody to think I edited it for my own benefit

            http://wvmetronews.com/2013/12/26/pennsylvanias-loss-could-be-west-virginias-gain/

            So you were only talking about WV, even though the article was about how things are done in PA and how they will be moving here?

            Yeah, keep backpedaling bud.

          • Jason412

            Just want to clarify if anyone reads the comments from the other article the "jason" saying he works in the gas industry is not me. But I notice how even though he said he's worked in the industry for 10 years wvredneck quickly dismisses him as "only looking things up on the internet"

            That just shows that in WVRedneck's mind only his word can be trusted, even if the other person also works in the industry. Because if you say you work in the industry and have anything bad to say, you're lying. If you say your friends work in the industry and have anything bad to say, you're lying. But when you tell people it takes 20 trucks instead of 1,000-3,000 you were "misunderstood"

      • WSC

        OK!!! One question! Would you buy a home or a piece of property, invest your money or the banks, without first getting a thorough inspection? NO! These guys knew what they were buying! And another question for you, HOW IN THIS WORLD DID THEY NOT KNOW THEY HAD A PROBLEM? Residents could smell it miles away, are you telling me these guys AT THE SITE WERE SURPRISED when first responders showed up! COME ON! GIVE ME A BREAK

      • WV Redneck

        Oh and by the way Jason. I was here in WV before the find in PA when they were drilling over 100 wells a year just for my company alone. How many "bad cement jobs"? Zero. How many tainted water wells? Zero. How many spills? Zero.

        Go watch the movie fracknation and learn some truth about the whole process and the accusations.

        • Jason412

          You don't believe the AG because it's a political position, ok.

          But all the AG was doing was repeating what she had been told by a Grand Jury. Are grand jury's, a group of selected citizens, also politically motivated positions? Are the grand juror's just pandering for votes, for an election that they're not involved in? Is that why they did this? Please enlighten me as you seem to have all the answers.

          You don't believe a grand jury when it's against your point of view but you the believe the Irish guy. Yeah, clearly you're open minded but only if it furthers your agenda.

          I notice Fracknation never mentions anything about even the possibility of bad cement. You admit that it happens, but say it's rare, he never even brings it up. He also doesn't mention anything about waste water spills or intentional dumps. Not a single word about any of the incidents with waste water.

          The whole documentary is about how the process of fracking doesn't poison the water, which everyone knows. Doesn't touch on any part of the things outside the actual process of drilling the well that do happen.

  • Harpers Ferry

    Hahaha!!! Who said its just the poor and lazy that ask for handouts?

  • Mountain Man

    Another POS company escaping any punishment. Only in WV.

    • Low Rider

      Only in WV? There were 1.2 million bankruptcy filings in the U.S. in 2012 with only 3000 in WV. This is a country wide problem.

      • DZirkle

        Why doesn't WV take the lead in irradicating bankruptcy abuse?????????????????

  • Low Rider

    That didn't take long. It looks like Erin Brokovich and her class action suit just went up in smoke.